Click below to Play. Go here to download on iTunes. Click to download the mp3 In today's episode, Suzanne Bates, the author of "Speak Like a CEO" and "Discover Your CEO Brand," sits down with us and talks about how leaders of companies can grow their business (no matter the size) by building their own personal brand. Highlights from today's podcast: \t Steve Jobs impact in business and life \tThe Steve Jobs story The importance of a CEO brand \tIt's more than business and technical skill \tUnderstand who you are and what you stand for \tWhat separates great from good? \tThe Ford Motor Company story \tWhat is a Fifeton? \tCollaboration and Cooperation \t Make a statement \tWhat is a brand? \t Brand is just as important for a small business \t Brand is based on the character of how you really are \tWhy a brand is the beginning of a conversation \tHow to find out about what people think of your brand \tHow social media affects your brand \tNew emerging CEO stars Click below to Play. Go here to download on iTunes. Click to download the mp3 If you can't listen, here's the text: Cool voice guy: Fueling your business success, this is the entrepreneur addiction podcast, breaking the small business loan news you need if you obsess about your company. Heard exclusively on Lendio.com. And now here are our your hosts: Brock Blake, Dan Bischoff and Patrick Wiscombe. Patrick: This podcast is sponsored by Lendio.com, the online source you need to find the right business financing to grow your company. So, check them out: Lendio.com, to get your business growing right now. It's the entrepreneur addiction podcast episode number seven. My name is Patrick Wiscombe. Thank you, as always, for tuning us in and taking us along wherever and however you're accessing the podcast, whether it be on Lendio.com or on Patrick.Wiscombe.com. And we have a terrific show planned for you today. Joining me for the podcast, Dan Bischoff, director of communications at Lendio.com. It's always good to see you. Dan: Great to see you again. Patrick: On a very, rainy morning. Dan: Where we are, maybe not where our guest is. Patrick: Yeah, that true. In fact, let's bring her in right now: Suzanne Bates. She is the author of a brand new book. It's only been out for, what did you say, two to three weeks, Suzanne? Suzanne: Yes, it just came out: “Discover Your CEO Brand.” Patrick: How timely is this in light of what happened with Steve Jobs? Let's just launch right into this. Let's first talk about Steve Jobs, and then let's talk about your book Discover Your CEO Brand. By the way, where can people buy it? Suzanne: You can get it on Amazon.com or any online bookstore, and you can find it in bookstores, too. Patrick: Okay, so, pick it up. Amazon.com. Pick it up at bookstores. And once we get done with this interview you're going to understand why Suzanne is an author and has decided to right this book. Let's talk about Steve Jobs. We've just received word. Oh, well, I shouldn't say we just received word. Dan: To people who are listening to this, it's probably old news by now. A few days. A couple days. Patrick: Yeah. Dan: But they'll probably be still talking about it because Steve Jobs is such a, like earlier before the podcast Suzanne said, such an iconic figure. Patrick: Let's talk about Steve Jobs for a minute. You mentioned, and in fact, I think the opening on the sleeve of your, on the dust jacket: Steve Jobs did it at Apple. Let's talk about Steve Jobs for a minute. Suzanne: Well, he is, without a doubt, the most iconic CEO of our time. He's made a profound impact on communications, of course, changing the way we communicate, not just, you know, in the first version of Apple with the Mac. But then with the iPhone and the iPod and the iPad. He was, without a doubt, an innovative genius. But he was much more than that. He really really embodied that innovative spirit, and what is so, I guess, astounding is that, I can't think of another CEO, and there are many great ones out there, I can't think of another CEO for whom the media would stop and run at a crawl when he passed away. So, his impact has been far beyond the business world. Everybody knows Steve Jobs' name, and you know, I think, they're are so many aspects of Steve Jobs that people admire. I first started working with executives myself ten years ago, when I launched my business bates communication after a twenty year career in television. And I've had ten years to study CEO's, to watch how they influence, motivate, and inspire others. And certainly he was unparallelled in his ability to communicate with passion and purpose. But there were a lot of other aspects about Steve Jobs that I think people admire. You know, when I was writing my new book, Discover Your CEO Brand, you're right, he was the first name that came to mind because he's the most powerful CEO brand in the world. Why is that? Well, your brand is really who you are and what you stand for. And Steve Jobs communicated that so clearly. He used that to unite and align his company around a common purpose and to energize that company. And he also used it to communicate with the wider world. His news conferences announcing products were highly anticipated global events. But, you know, when you really think about Steve Jobs, is that we really understood who he was and what he stood for. He tells a wonderful, wonderful story in his commencement speech at Stanford University back in, I think, 2006. He actually shared three very personal stories about his life, that I think says so much his character. Well, one of the stories was about how when he was born he was actually adopted. His birth mother, though, found out that the adoptive parents had not gone to college. She wouldn't sign the papers until they promised to send him to college. Well, eighteen years later he gets to college, and he doesn't really see the point. His parents are spending every penny of their life savings to send him to Reid College, but he doesn't know why he's there. So, he drops out. But he takes a calligraphy course while he's still on campus, and that's where he discovers this interest or passion, if you will, for beautiful, elegant design. And in the speech, he tells these students that it's very difficult for any of us to connect the dots forward. In other words, it's hard for us where a particular experience in life might lead us or how it might shape us, or shape our values. But looking back, what happened was, that appreciation for design found its way into the typography of the Mac computer. So, Steve Jobs so eloquently shows us how you can connect the dots backward and understand and interpret the experiences of your life in a way that is meaningful for others. And I think what he did so effectively was, he transferred that knowledge and passion into products that are so intuitive, so beautifully designed and therefore are in such demand. And he, of course, was really a visionary as well. But being a visionary isn't enough. As a CEO, you have to be able to communicate that to your organization, so they align around a common purpose, and to the world, so they understand, you know, what you're selling and why it's valuable. So, I think Steve Jobs will be right up there with the pantheon of the great leaders that are talked about a hundred years from now. Patrick: Let's jump over to your book here, and let's talk about Discover Your CEO Brand. Why did you write the book? Suzanne: Well, I think it's so important for leaders to understand that it's more than business and technical skills that's required to run a great company. It's very important for us as leaders to understand who we are and what we stand for because those values of ours get driven down into the organization. Steve Jobs is one wonderful example, but there are many other examples of successful leaders. And what separates them from, from the great from the good, is this ability to communicate your values and to be able to align people around those common values. And, you know, I'll take another example just to illustrate what I mean. Alan Mulally, probably the hottest CEO brand today, the CEO and chairman of Ford. When he was invited by the Ford Motor Company to take the job as CEO, he didn't have any experience in the automotive industry. He had spent 37 years at Boeing and actually had been passed over for CEO twice. So, he didn't know anything about the automotive industry and, of course, Ford was in big trouble. As we all know, it was a house of brands, and there were fiefdoms, and people weren't working across cultures, and there he was... Patrick: What did you say, fiefdoms? Suzanne: Fiefdoms, yeah. Patrick: What is a fiefdom? That's a big word for this podcast. (laughter) Suzanne: Well, what it means is, they operated in silos. There were no cooperation across the brands, or across the businesses, or across the functions at Ford. And so, he came in, and he was a passionate but also motivating leader, and he also was a 'big picture' guy. And where did he get that? Well, he grew up in Kansas City. He used to sit in the front pews watching his minister and how he influenced the congregation. So, he became a student of influence. He considered his minster to be, you know, a mentor and an inspiration. And also, he was in the era, you know, he was in the era when JFK challenged America to land a man on the moon, and he considered that a personal, almost a personal quest. He went and got his aviation, his flying, what do you call it: he learned how to fly. (Laughter) And then he launched his career at Boeing. He was a big vision guy. He thought big, and he was a student of influence. So, he was exactly the right leader at the right time to come into Ford Motor Company and to get people to start to collaborate and cooperate across the organization. And as a result, you know, as we all know, in 2010 Ford posted a 6 billion dollar profit, and that was a 20 billion dollar turnaround. Patrick: Ford's story is phenomenal. In fact, I never understood why they were such a colossal failure there for a while until he came in. And I think the most telling this is that he did not accept the government bailout because he knew what he was building. Should companies except bailouts if they're in real trouble? Suzanne: Well, he was making a statement, wasn't he? Patrick: He was. Suzanne: To me, it's the same thing as, if you play football, you win the coin toss, and you elect to kick, not receive. It's expressing confidence in your team and, you know, that message must have reverberated at Ford. It wasn't, it was a statement for the world, but also a statement to his own leadership team. You know, there's a great story about when he came in. He got the entire leadership team of Ford together every week, not every quarter as happens in most companies. And at the first meeting he asked the managers to come in and color code the data: green was good; yellow was trouble, I mean, yellow was there was a problem; red was really got to stop and pay attention. The first meeting everybody brought in their data in green, and he says to everybody, he says, “Well, last time I checked, we were about to post a 14 billion dollar with a loss, a billion dollars with a 'B' loss.” So, he says, “Something must be wrong.” So, the next week, one guy comes in with his data in red, and Alan Mulally starts to clap. He claps and starts an applause, and after that the next week, more people obviously started coming in with their stuff in red. But what was even more interesting was, people started putting up their hands, people from other businesses, or other functions, saying, “Hey, I can help you with that. I've had experience with that. I can help you with that.” And that is how he began to break down the barriers at Ford and bring it together and united as one company. So, what, I mean, that's confidence. That's confidence in your own ability to lead and in your own vision and in your ability to bring people together. Patrick: Dan? Dan: Can we strip this down a little bit? A lot of listeners range from the guy that owns the pizza shop to serial entrepreneur. Let's talk about what a brand, you know, in essence is, and the difference between the corporate brand, the personal brand of the business owner, how those mesh, and those types of things. Suzanne: Yeah, that's a really good question, and that's me. I'm that entrepreneur. I have a company with about a dozen people, and I started in television. So, I didn't know anything about business before I started my business ten years ago. As a matter of fact, at the end of the first year, my accountant sat me down and said, “You know, you've done a great job this year, but I do want to talk to you about accounts receivable.” And I said, “Great! What are accounts receivable?” (Laughter) Patrick: Oh, so we're going accounting101 here? Suzanne: Yeah, though what I mean to say is, I started from scratch myself. And the question of brand for an entrepreneur with a small to medium size business is just as important as it is for a Fortune 500 company. So, what is a brand? A brand is a thought or a feeling that lives in the mind of another person. So, when you think about a company brand, you know, maybe you think about Amazon.com, the most trusted brand in the world today. You know, you have a thought about what it is and what your experience is with that brand. Well, similarly when people hear your name, they also have a thought and often a feeling about you, and that in essence is your brand. So, it's based, though, not on PR, not on marketing, but on who you really are, or how people really know you. Patrick: You mean, character? Suzanne: Character. It's based on character, and Abraham Lincoln once said, “Character is the tree, and reputation is the shadow.” So, you think of reputation or brand as the shadow, but the real thing is your character. And what I like to say to entrepreneurs is, you know, there's an old expression, “Brand is more than a word; it's the beginning of a conversation.” And the question you should be asking yourself as an entrepreneur is “What's the conversation people are having about me?” In other words, what are they saying about me out there? What is my reputation? And what can I do to enhance my reputation and be sure people know the authentic me because as an entrepreneur, you have an even greater opportunity to drive value into your business when people know you and understand who you are and appreciate your character. Patrick: Let's talk about your brand, Suzanne Bates. How do you find out what people are saying about you? You know, kind of a fly on the wall. Suzanne: Yeah, it's so important to do that. Well, there's a lot of ways you can find out. I mean, today we have actually more opportunities than ever. Market research is easier to do than ever, and while market research can be about your company, it can also incorporate information gathering about you. You could read your clippings. You know, they don't call them that anymore, but you can look at your own digital footprint. I think it's very important for entrepreneurs, even of small companies, to think about their digital footprint. In other words, “How do people find you today?” It's either through Google or uTube, which is as searched a vehicle as Google is. But what are the other ways? Are you on LinkedIn? Does twitter make sense for you, for your business strategy? Facebook. You know, we have so many ways to get our names out there, and also to get feedback about what are brands really are. And, you know, building a digital footprint is something every entrepreneur should be thinking about. Suzanne: You know, with social media, with how big it is right now, too, I think that's more important. I think people are, they want to connect with individuals rather than just a logo, or a corporate personality. Yesterday we had a complaint online and, you know, we tried to reach out with our company's Twitter feed. Patrick: You mean, Lendio? Dan: Uh, huh. Patrick: Okay. Dan: We reached out with our company's Twitter feed, and got crickets, right? Then we had the individual, the vice president of operations, reach out personally, and then she responded and it fixed the whole situation. And then a bad situation ended up being a better situation. But it's because of the individual. And, you know, I'm sure that relates to having a personal brand than just the company brand too. So, you want to talk to the individual instead of that corporate idea. Suzanne: You sure do. Yeah, it's kind of an interesting thing that while we have this crazy digital intimacy now where, you know, everything's online and all of that, people crave that kind of personal connection. I know, I posted a blog about a company not long ago, and I don't usually talk about customer service, but it was such bad customer service that I felt compelled to do so. And it was interesting because within a day, someone from that company called me and wanted to follow up and be sure that, you know, the problem had been resolved. And it made a difference. It really does. You still need to have the personal touch, and that is something that you can do as an entrepreneur. Patrick: Is the personal touch gone from business, and does it need to come back? Suzanne: Not at all. Well, look, not with successful people. Successful people know how important the personal touch is, and they use electronic, or online media, social media, social networking, social marketing, just to expand or stay in touch with their markets. You can't meet everybody. It's very had to meet everybody. But you can run your business with a personal touch and that, as your business grows, that means you have to train your employees to deliver service with a personal touch as well. Patrick: Who is doing social media right? Suzanne: Here's what I notice: I notice when CEO's are blogging now, and a lot of CEO's don't want to blog because, first of all, they don't really know what the value of it is. They don't feel that they have time to write, and they aren't sure what to write about. But I'll give you an example of somebody who I think does that superbly. His name is George Colony at Forrester Research. Now, they're not a tiny company, but they're not a company most people have heard of either. They do research. They do analytical research for other companies. They're a B to B business, and he's a big believe of social media. And if you read his blogs, he's a great writer. His blogs really represent the business. You know, they're on the cutting edge, and they need to be out there. And they need to be talking about thought leadership ideas. So, blogging is aligned with their business strategy, but it's also aligned with who he is. Talk about brands. I interviewed him for my book, and he's got a real position on social media for CEO's, which is “You should be out there.” Because there is such a lack of intimacy, people are craving knowing who is the CEO of the company, or who is the leader of the company. “Who are these people behind that website?” Patrick: “And what is the CEO thinking?” Suzanne: “And what's the CEO thinking?” And, you know, that's a way for people to know your company. To know you is to know your company, and that's true whether you're a founder or whether you have come in to run a company. I mean, another example of a company that I think does this well is Constant Contact. And Gail Goodman, the current CEO, is not the founder of the company. But she does a great job representing their brand out there and, of course, she's a big believe in social media, too. What they do at Constant Contact is they facilitate small businesses like mine in keeping in touch with their customers. So, they've mastered that. They know a lot about it, and I think she's very good at representing her company's brand. Dan: Why do so many business owners neglect building a personal brand, do you think? Suzanne: Well, look, we're all busy, and there's always something to do. There's more to do on your 'to do' list than you can do in a day when you're an entrepreneur. So, you have to make choices everyday, and I do believe that you should color code your calender. Because if you don't create balance, for example if you're focus is all internal, than your brand won't become known, and you won't be as successful as deserve to be. You need to leverage yourself, and you need to be doing the things that only you can do. And that's, I understand, sometimes easier said than done for entrepreneurs. Like I said, you're doing everything from ordering the supplies to going out and speaking about your companies. So, believe me, I've been there. I've lived it. But one of the things that I discovered when I started working hard at the brand Billing Peace was how it helped grow my company exponentially. And that's why I've written three books. That's why I do blogs every week. That's why I'm on Twitter, and that's why I go out and speak and do media interviews. I really believe that as a leader of a company, whether you're a company of five or fifteen or fifty or five hundred, you are in a unique position to be the face and voice of your organization, and you have to carve out time for this. You have to invest in it because investing in this is investing in your company. Dan: I think this is a great way to compete with larger companies, too, especially today with being able to blog and to put your message out there, your individual message. It's the way you can compete with those guys now. Suzanne: It's really true. I mean, there's a cartoon. I don't know whether you've every seen it where, you know, there's a dog sitting in front of a computer. And the expression is something like, “They don't know you're a dog.” (Laughter) It's true. I mean, they don't know how big you are. If you have a big presence out there, nobody knows. Dan: You do that, and you get higher search rankings, too, and you know, social. I have one more question before maybe we can get into some of the how to build a brand, too. But, you know, for a lot of the Lendio customers seeking financing, that personal brand is a big influence on, especially angel investors and venture capitalists and even the banks. And from your experience, how have you seen a personal brand influence getting financing. Suzanne: Well, I can tell you from my personal experience, and also from my experience interviewing many, many leaders about going through, you know, obtaining financing. In my own situation, I have a phenomenal relationship with my bank. I've never had investor financing, but my bank is incredibly receptive when I walk in the door. And I do believe it's not just about how much money I have deposited there, though certainly that is a factor. But another factor is whether they believe in you, and when they see that you're out there, and when they that you're building your business, they know that other people know you, and know about you, they have confidence to lend to you. And I just closed a leasing deal recently that got done in 48 hours because of that. Dan: Nice. Suzanne: Yeah, so in my personal experience, I think it's necessary to make sure your bank or your investors are aware of what your brand is and are aware of what your doing to build your brand because it can make all difference. Dan: The investors and lenders, I mean, they want to make money, and they know if they trust you and your character that you'll work hard then you'll have the ability to get it done that, you know, it'll be good for them to. So, you know, it's a no-brainer from that point alone, right? Suzanne: It is, and it comes into play in so many ways. I mean, I don't know how many of your listeners have ever been interested in writing a book. But I can tell you that when I put together my book proposal, and I put together the marketing piece of it, what I was again sharing with them was “Where am I? Where can you find me out there? What am I doing? You know, what media am I doing? What speaking am I doing? How can you find me? How can you find my blog?” That made a huge difference in landing three book contracts. Patrick: Wow! Dan: Yeah, let's talk about those books, too. I mean, I was wondering, too, if without those books where would you be? And then, let's talk about “Speak Like a CEO” and how that can help some entrepreneurs as well. Suzanne: Yeah. Well, I'm a big believer in books because the book your write is the book you're going to write. It's one of those things that establishes your unique brand. It gets your thought leadership out there. And when you're an author of a book, you get all kinds of invitations to speak at conferences. And when you talk about a fast... Dan: You get the prestigious invite to get on the Lendio podcast, too. Patrick: (Laughter) Suzanne: That's right! Well, leading me to my next point, which is you get an amazing number of offers to do media interviews. And you just never know who that's going to go out to and who is going to hear it. So, for me, the books have been the foundational piece, the corner stone piece, of building a brand. It can't be the only thing you do. I always like to say, “When you write a book, it's like having a baby: the writing of the book is having the baby, but then you have to raise the baby!” And that's all the publicity and the media and the speaking and everything else you do to help that book, you know, gain recognition. I think we're in a time when the role of the CEO is changing. It's getting really rocked by the new communication tools and channels that we have today. So, you have, sort of, the later stage generation still, you know, in the CEO role right now. You have basically Baby Boomers for CEO's, and Baby Boomers think of themselves as pretty hip and cool. But they also grew up in a different time. So, for many Baby Boom generation, C-level leaders, or presidents, or vice presidents in organizations, they're still really trying to get their arms around how to make social media work for them and work for their companies. But you do have a new generation of leaders coming up through the ranks, and everybody is aware of, when we're communicating across four generations in the workplace, we have to be more flexible. We have to be more in-tune. We have to reach people the way we can reach them. You know, it's a diverse world that we live in. People get their information in different ways. They have many different preferences and a lot of choices about how they get their information, which is why it's so important to have a strategy, an internal communication strategy. You can't reach people just one way. Many people don't check their email now. I mean, that's one in example. But a lot of people are on email all day. So, you have to have a way of reaching everybody, and making sure everybody gets the message. Patrick: Is there any up in coming CEO's that you have your eye on, any where between, you know, maybe your top five, that you're going, “Man, those guys are just getting it!”? Suzanne: I'd like to talk about a women who's a CEO of a Fortune 500 company because we haven't talked about women. Of course, they're not well represented in the C-ranks as of yet. But Ursula Burns, who is the CEO and chairman of Xerox Corporation, and interestingly, she's the first African American women to lead a Fortune 500 company. And she was appointed by another women, Anne Mulcahy, so they've had two women in a row at Xerox, as most people know. And I think Ursula Burns is a very inspiring CEO who really understands who she is and what she stands for. She had an improbably start. She grew up poor, but her mother always, sort of, “Pull it together.” She taught her kids not to be a victim of their circumstance, never to let their circumstance to define them. When she went to work at Xerox as a summer intern, she had a degree in mechanical engineering, but the best job she could get was as an administrative assistant. And she tells a story how she went to a company meeting one time, and she kept hearing the president of the company at the time talking about how they were having a hiring freeze. But then Xerox would hire another thousand more people. So, finally in a meeting, she puts up her hand, and she says, “Um, Mr. Allaire, I'm just confused. If you keep saying no hiring and we keep hiring a thousand people, how are we going to make no hiring stick?” Well, he calls her into his office. Patrick: (Laughter) Oh, boy! Suzanne: And she thinks... I know she probably thought she was going to get fired. But he offers her a job as his executive assistant. But what she learned from that experience was to give voice no matter what her position, was to give voice to her ideas. And I think that's a huge part of her brand, and it's without a doubt the reason she rose to the top job at Xerox. Patrick: In terms of discovering your CEO brand, I noticed, as I'm sitting here talking to you, is that you're an executive coach as well. Suzanne: Yes. Patrick: Now, one of the things that I find personally satisfying is to have someone who is not invested in me as a person, but can speak objectively. Executive coaching, while I used to think it was kind of hokey. I'll just tell you, I thought it was really hokey there for a while. I have totally done a one eighty on that. They can speak objectively on that because they're not tied up into the emotion, and they can think objectively. What kind of executive coaching do you do? Suzanne: Well, our coaching is specific to communication and leadership, and we work with leaders who have built great businesses, built great companies, and are now either on the cusp of taking on a new role, or have taken on a new role, and they really need to drive the business forward. 80% of what a leader has to do is communicate and motivate and inspire people, and communicate the vision and strategy in a way the aligns everybody around that common purpose. So, the coaching we do is to help leaders recognize what are their skill sets that they have. What are the skill sets they need? Where are the gaps? And then we also help them develop their communication strategy. So, I think it's very important when you're looking for a coach, to look for somebody who, you know, is going to challenge you. Is going to see you. Is going to be on your team, is also, as you suggest, is also going to hold up a mirror and help you see who you are and where you are and where you need to go. I personally have had coaching as well, and I couldn't agree with you more. It's very lonely at the top, and it's important to have people who can come in and show you the facts and tell you the truth, and motivate you to make the decisions you need to make to drive your business forward. Patrick: And you can't go home and talk to your spouse about this all the time. Otherwise, your relationship totally changes. Suzanne: (Laughter) It's so true. I can tell you from personal experience. You know, all of us who have gone home and talked and gnashed their teeth and cried and screamed to our spouses, know it's hard to be the spouse of an entrepreneur. And I remember one of the first times I brought in a consultant. He wasn't so much of a coach as he was a consultant. But when we started talking about this issue that was driving me a little bit crazy, and I realized how much knowledge he brought to the conversation, and really began to trust in him, it improved my marriage tremendously. (Laughter). Patrick: Interesting. Dan: Well, before we go, too, let's talk about how people can get in touch with you and your other two books, too. I mean, one of your books Speak Like a CEO is an international best seller in five different languages. And I just want to help people find out about you and your books. Suzanne: Oh, well, thank you. Well, our website is Bates-Communications.com, and you can find my books at Amazon.com. Just look for Suzanne Bates, and if you want to follow me on Twitter, I'm @CEOCoachBates. Patrick: (Laughter) Coach Bates. Dan: I'm following you. Suzanne: Oh, great! CEOCoachBates. Dan: Can I call you coach? Suzanne: Yeah! Call me coach! And we have a popular newsletter. It's called Thoughts For Tuesday. It comes out, obviously, every Tuesday, and it has lots of tips for entrepreneurs and business people on how to communicate and build your brand. You can sign up for Thoughts For Tuesday on our website at Bates-Communications.com. Patrick: It has been an absolute privilege to have Suzanne Bates, the author of Discover Your CEO Brand, on with us today. Thank you so much. Suzanne: Thank you, Dan and Patrick. Both of you, thank you. Dan: There's a lot of great information, in your head, that you have. Suzanne: (Laughter) Thanks. Dan: And like you said, it's great to have a woman on here, right? Patrick: Yeah, it is because it's been male dominated so far. Dan: Yeah. Patrick: So, for Suzanne Bates, author of Discover Your CEO Brand. It's only been out for two to three weeks. Be sure to pick it up at Amazon.com. Dan Bischoff, always good to see you, director of communications at Lendio. Dan: It's great to see you again. Patrick: My name is Patrick Wiscombe. Thanks again for listening to the Entrepreneur Addiction Podcast. So, for Suzanne, Dan, I'm Patrick, talk to you next week. See ya. Voice: Making business loans simple, this has been the entrepreneur addiction podcast, helping you secure the capital you need, with your host Brock Blake, Dan Bischoff, and Patrick Wiscombe. Heard exclusively at Lendio.com.